Gorik Member Posts: 156
August 15 in General Discussions
Should, Windows be given a cool down again. Nothing crazy, maybe like 10 seconds, which is very reasonable I believe, and still aids new players.
But it does stop it being used constantly due to the fact that it is overall a strong perk with no cooldown, but also not to nerfed like the old 30 second cooldown.
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doobiedo Member Posts: 36
August 15 edited August 15
No. It should actually be basekit in its current form along with Kindred.
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jesterkind Member Posts: 7,478
August 15
No, I don't think that's an appropriate change.
I think if you want to nerf Windows - and that's kind of a shaky proposition right now since it really doesn't warrant it - a better nerf would be to shrink its range a little bit. Right now it has a range of 32 metres, that could hypothetically be changed.
Not much reason to do that right now, though.
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AggressiveFTW Member Posts: 1,040
August 15
I just want them to focus on bad perks and not do ANYTHING to the good ones. The good ones constantly always get changed to "shift meta", but what does that do to all the bad perks? Nothing. We need focus on bad perks. I'm tired of seeing good perks get changed, not for nerfing reasons but they don't need the attention.
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Gorik Member Posts: 156
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781544#Comment_3781544
Yeah tbh, thats a good idea.
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Gorik Member Posts: 156
August 15 edited August 15
Maybe like 24 meters max, even 16 might be ok
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Gorik Member Posts: 156
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781539#Comment_3781539
Why
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HexHuntressThighs Member Posts: 1,063
August 15 edited August 15
After 500 hours of gameplay the perk is deleted from your account.
The problem is it’s great for new people to teach them the game. And for veterans to not get caught at a loop without a pallet. It’s definitely an autopilot perk that has consistent and insane value. I’m not great at looping but when I use Windows I become borderline uncatchable.
A 10 second cooldown wouldn’t do anything anyways as you could remember 2-3 pallets at a time.
Edit: I better specify the first sentence is a joke before people start going crazy
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doobiedo Member Posts: 36
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781562#Comment_3781562
Because the game has gotten Killer sided enough as it is. We need basekit Windows and Kindred to help balance it out.
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doobiedo Member Posts: 36
August 15 edited August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781564#Comment_3781564
This is actually not true all considering I regularly see streamers with like 8000 hours using it. Like to see your gameplay where you're "uncatchable" just from using Windows. It should be basekit considering the insane amount of maps now.
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Brimp Member Posts: 2,819
August 15
It should have never lost the cooldown to begin with. I see people say "it can get changed when maps arent terrible" not like I see the average window survivor still make every pallet just by holding W.
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WolfyWood Member Posts: 373
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781580#Comment_3781580
As the person who said that I have to reiterate that Windows does nothing when every pallet is godawful and only slightly better than a dead zone.
There is no reason to nerf it currently.
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Brimp Member Posts: 2,819
August 15 edited August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781598#Comment_3781598
Maybe on the theatre but most pallets on macmillan, red forest, gideons, crotus prenn, garden of joy, badham, eyrie and autohaven which is a majority of the realms against a majority of the killers…. are just either decent or mostly safe
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- See AlsoWhen will the developers finally adapt “Windows of Opportunity”? - Page 3Dead By Daylight: 9 Best Killer PerksLethal Persuer needs a Nerf Hammer
Orionbash Member Posts: 763
August 15
Killers have Frankenweave but heaven forbid we have one perk that lets us see pallets.
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HexHuntressThighs Member Posts: 1,063
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781566#Comment_3781566
Coincidentally I have a YouTube channel with a video where I called it overpowered and let me tell you what I was in fact uncatchable. Well right into the end lol. Go watch it and there is your proof.
And yes I said vets use it too lol. Its just really good for new people too so it probably shouldn't be nerfed.
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doobiedo Member Posts: 36
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781648#Comment_3781648
Well I would ask you to link to the video but it doesn't matter anyway because one video escaping against baby killers means nothing. Now if you can stream 8 hours a day for a week maybe and escape every single time the same way killers go on 1000 game win streaks then maybe you would have a point.
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Brimp Member Posts: 2,819
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781647#Comment_3781647
Franklin attunement is unironically and should be so weak. Survivors control the power of the perk combo and if you simply just… place the items in the corner of a map that killer no longer has access to half their build.
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HexHuntressThighs Member Posts: 1,063
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781653#Comment_3781653
Do you know the definition of the word exaggeration? Or Hyperbole? Obviously I still lose but I do significantly better anytime I use it.
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Toystory3Monkey Member Posts: 262
August 15
No, it's perfectly fine as a perk. It shouldnt be nerfed nor should it be basekit. It's a definition of an actual crutch perk that does nothing if you're good and helps you to perform better if you lack necessary game sense.
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Orionbash Member Posts: 763
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781657#Comment_3781657
The game shouldnt be designed to leave the items you earn in a corner of the map every game because killers need constant aura reading. lol Thats bad game design.
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Brimp Member Posts: 2,819
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781662#Comment_3781662
A lot of things counter different things. It's not bad game design its called adapting. Would you rather have a killer lose half their build for the cost of a couple items or have the aura reading? Personally no aura reading is a MAJOR advantage for the survivors especially when they know that those 2 perks could have been more slowdown.
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doobiedo Member Posts: 36
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781659#Comment_3781659
Then why do streamers with over 8000 hours and in the top percent of mmr use it?
1
doobiedo Member Posts: 36
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781658#Comment_3781658
The point is its not an exaggeration or hyperbole when Killers go on 1000 game win streaks. Like this literally happens all the time. No Survivor perks should be nerfed until the balance of the game is better and its not possible for killers to do this anymore. Its amazing that Killer mains here will say that Woo needs a nerf but Weave doesn't.
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HexHuntressThighs Member Posts: 1,063
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781675#Comment_3781675
Those win streaks happen on S-A tier killers and the people playing them have thousands of hours on those killer specifically. Many people say Huntress is S Tier and Godlike OP but her highest streak after 8 years is 101 and its not even official if they got that high.
Survivors have gotten a 383 escape streak. So should Huntress be buffed?
Streaks depend on the skill of the player. No random person is going on a 1,000 win streak as Blight OR Nurse unless they have a significant amount of hours in those killers. You cant just pick up a killer randomly and do that, it doesn't happen.
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Toystory3Monkey Member Posts: 262
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781662#Comment_3781662
how exactly?
if you word things in a reductive way like that it all sounds bad.
"The game shouldnt be designed for one side to be faster, stronger and invulnerable, while the other cant even damage the opponent because the killers can only kill if survivors cant fight bad." bad game design.
"The game shouldnt be designed to hold m1 and press space bar occasionally every game to complete main objective because it needs to keep survivors busy and give killer time to kill them." bad game design.
the only real issue with franklin/weave is how hard it can be to find the item to then pick it up & relocate. they should make survivors see the aura of the dropped item if they're within aura range. otherwise it's entirely on survivors how hard they get ######### on by a combo that only works from basic attacks.
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doobiedo Member Posts: 36
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781678#Comment_3781678
Can you link me to this "383 escape streak." Just curious about it because I've never heard of one that high.
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HexHuntressThighs Member Posts: 1,063
August 15
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781711#Comment_3781711
It was done by WimaTV and they only live streamed it over the course of months so it's in vods that now don't exist I believe. You can see them talking about it on their twitter. However Hens has a 218 escape streak video on YouTube called Escaping 200 games in a row
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doobiedo Member Posts: 36
August 16
I mean either way those streaks are much smaller than the Killer streaks, they are on coms, and they are from years ago when the game had not gotten as killer sided as it is now. I would guess they would not be able to get as high of a streak now that killer has been buffed so much, and even back then killers were still getting the higher streaks. Just sick of reading the echo chambers of delusional killer mains claiming the game is still survivor sided when at this point it is more killer sided then it has ever been.
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Crowman Member Posts: 9,217
August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781647#Comment_3781647
Weave is already getting changed in a future update. Guess this means we need to nerf Woo.
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Gorik Member Posts: 156
August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781739#Comment_3781739
So I haven't really commenting even though this is my post, but my guy, this game has been survivor sided since release. The 4 best survs will always beat the best Killer, thats the nature of the beast.
The fact it's 4v1 alone makes it more surv sided. Just saying, been playing like 7 years and it's been like that always.
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Shroompy Member Posts: 6,365
August 16
We really gonna talk about this again huh?
I can guarantee you, Windows aint the reason youre losing games.
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I_CAME Member Posts: 1,200
August 16
Killer mains will whine either way. If it's as strong as they say then a nerf will cause escape rates to tank. In that case Behavior will just buff survivors in other ways. They have the 40% escape rate as their current target so they aren't going to let it dip below that for an extended period. They will then complain about whatever buffs survivors receive to boost them back to a 40% escape rate. If it doesn't have any impact on escape rates then they will complain about something else instead.
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Gorik Member Posts: 156
August 16
I mean, I was just asking a general question, we should probably all remember we enjoy playing this game, because the way some of you all are writing, you'd think this game murdered a family member for real or something and revenge and hatred are the only emotions you have left.
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doobiedo Member Posts: 36
August 16
I
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781746#Comment_3781746
It maybe was Survivor sided for most of its life but its not anymore. The fact that the kill rate target is 60% proves that Bhv is even TRYING to make it killer sided. I dont even have a problem with the game being intended to be killer sided I just think its been pushed slightly too far and could use a balance adjustment to make it less frustrating for new players especially. And the point about being 1 vs. 4 thus automatically giving the advantage to the side with 4 makes no sense in an assymetrical game where by definition each side plays with different rules.
Orionbash Member Posts: 763
August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781755#Comment_3781755
I dont enjoy DBD personally. Not anymore. 2v8 rekindled the spark, but its gone for now. This game needs a huge overhaul in terms of balance before I would touch the main game again.
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doobiedo Member Posts: 36
August 16 edited August 16
Off topic but is there no way to completely delete a post on this forum?
Ayodam Member Posts: 2,588
August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781742#Comment_3781742
Distortion is receiving a nerf before Weave. What else ya got?
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Crowman Member Posts: 9,217
August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781791#Comment_3781791
Distortion wasn't mention in the post I replied too. It's also not an aura reading perk.
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Anti051 Member Posts: 592
August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781672#Comment_3781672
Makes chases a lot less dangerous if you always know precisely where to path.
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Kaitsja Member Posts: 1,787
August 16 edited August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781564#Comment_3781564
WoO is a great perk, but it's not the problem. It's a symptom of the problem, which is too many strong loops and tiles within close proximity of each other. Something BHVR has already started working to address.
It's also worth mentioning that many of the newer maps/map reworks are filled with pallets, but most of them are so weak that you can just avoid them altogether.
Post edited by Kaitsja on
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Toystory3Monkey Member Posts: 262
August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781672#Comment_3781672
because it allows them to turn the brain off and run to yellow which is very useful when you have to play the game for dozens of hours daily while reading chat.
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caipt Unconfirmed, Member Posts: 452
August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781566#Comment_3781566
If the reason you want basekit windows is because you dont know the maps, thats a skill issue.
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jajay119 Member Posts: 951
August 16
No. it does the job it’s supposed to do and not every perk needs a change cause killers aren’t getting the downs they feel entitled to quick enough. Do you want Lethal or Corrupt to be changed? The rational for them is the same premise as for WoO.
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doobiedo Member Posts: 36
August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781943#Comment_3781943
If you can't find survivors without aura perks or stop them from doing gens without slowdown perks that's a lot more a skill issue.
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AmpersandUnderscore Member Posts: 1,515
August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781665#Comment_3781665
But this "base kit counter" everyone talks about is a form of slowdown.
You have to reveal your aura to the killer at the start of the match, and then go find a corner to drop your item in. It's like lethal pursuer, a mini corrupt intervention, and means you don't have an item until you waste more time going to get it later. Which doesn't even touch on oblivious. And, I can't emphasize this enough: that's if you're "countering" the combo.
It does even more than that if you don't counter it, so it's basically like at least 4 perks in place of two. Or even just one, since people will see weave and automatically assume the killer has franklin's, even if they aren't running it.
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Langweilg Member Posts: 499
August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781544#Comment_3781544
Agree, if anything the range should be smaller.
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Langweilg Member Posts: 499
August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781547#Comment_3781547
16m would be too small.
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doobiedo Member Posts: 36
August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781988#Comment_3781988
Hilarious that the echo chamber of Killer main's on this forum think a perk that just lets you see windows and pallets needs a nerf but one that can give you mapwide wallhacks and has no realistic counterplay in many scenarios is perfectly fine. Real skill issue on their part.
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Rulebreaker Member Posts: 1,741
August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781988#Comment_3781988
And like lethal and corrupt, it's a one time thing if it's countered. The time is also variable depending on survivors and spawns. We often get thrown in a corner of the map to spawn so in cases like that time is negligible. If it's like those perks then it's a extremely worse version of them as it's almost completely under the Survivors control unlike normal lethal or corrupt. Survivors can also shockingly play without items. The counter may act like a slowdown, but it's only a 1 time thing for everyone who brought an item (0 times for those who don't) and not nearly as strong as actual slowdown perks.
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Deathstroke Member Posts: 3,464
August 16
Nah it's fine not all useful survivor perks need to be nerfed.
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AmpersandUnderscore Member Posts: 1,515
August 16
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3782005#Comment_3782005
And yet there's no downside for the killer.
You get the benefit of 2 perks if survivors "counter" the combo, and you get the benefit of 2 perks if the survivors *don't* counter it also.
So if the killer gets value no matter what, that sounds remarkably like there's no meaningful counterplay to this combo.
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